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Non sparky blade.


hawkati
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Here on offer (sorry) is a blade engined cbr 400 that turns over all day but won't spark. It's gotta be something obvious,  right? Not neutral cut out - that's fine. Connected clutch wires, ditto sidestand wires. Got me wondering about coils now. It's not at all clear on the wiring diagram but I've connected yellow/blue wires to the green input on coils and black/white wires to the black input. Have I got that wrong? I'd swap but I'm wary of frying the bastard. 

Apologies for poor pics. But heyelp? 

20210604_215742

 

Wiring_Diagram_CBR900RR_W&X_UK (1)

 

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With a plug in hand you can surely test coils? 

What about a sidestand switch? 

Honda innit... it's not the bike.... it's you ;)

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, CMSMJ1 said:

With a plug in hand you can surely test coils? 

What about a sidestand switch? 

Honda innit... it's not the bike.... it's you ;)

That's it - I've used a sparkplug to comprehensively prove there's no spark,  despite linking clutch cut out wires, sidestand wires, neutral thingy and even with killswitch engaged/disengaged just in case it's wired back to front. Also done the pliers over the starter solenoid just in case it's an ignition wiring issue but no joy.

I know, it's me.😬

 

Edit to add - used two different brand new spark plugs just in case etc.

Edited by hawkati
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3 minutes ago, CMSMJ1 said:

It turns over but no sparks? 

Correct CDI? Correct pickups?

I sincerely hope so - the engine, cdi, coils & loom all came from the same bike...

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1 hour ago, Alex_H said:

Have you got 12v between the black/white wire on the coil and battery negative? 

cheers for asking. I don't know - multimeter gone walkies so i'll be buying another along with a big box of mini fuses after work. Cheers!

 

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6 minutes ago, Pants said:

you fixed it?  I quite like the sound of a blade engined cbr400....

nope - that's why i'm asking....it's going to be something really stupid but i'm having no joy gettign a spark. Once it's sorted and road legal you are more than welcome to have a play...

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Can you check for cdi inputs/outputs when you get the next multimeter?   Maybe try borrowing another cdi if you can't.  

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5 hours ago, hawkati said:

nope - that's why i'm asking....it's going to be something really stupid but i'm having no joy gettign a spark. Once it's sorted and road legal you are more than welcome to have a play...

gis a go mista! gis a go!

 

actually, I'll show you mine if you show me yours....

 

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Halfrauds closed half an hour before time tonight so no joy there. Cracked on with it, aided on phone by other ldu contestants, especially @Thunderbolt. Cheers!

Got earth from black coil wires but still no spark. Gnash. I'll carry on tomorrow...

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14 hours ago, Alex_H said:

Have you got 12v between the black/white wire on the coil and battery negative? 

Yes he has.

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If it was coils it would be one rather both. I'd look at the pickup wiring and make sure its plugged into the right bit of loom. 

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6 hours ago, Evilchicken0 said:

If it was coils it would be one rather both. I'd look at the pickup wiring and make sure its plugged into the right bit of loom. 

It is. Cheers....😪

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Is the pick up connected and does it have a healthy resistance? 

There's not a massive list of bits to stop it firing, pick up, wiring, coil, cdi, plug/cap. 

Not sure on hondas but kawasaki used to fit a resistor in the ignition switch, so any attempt to hot wire it would send too much voltage to the cdi and it'd not spark... Are you on the standard ignition barrel? 

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3 hours ago, wavey said:

Is the pick up connected and does it have a healthy resistance? 

There's not a massive list of bits to stop it firing, pick up, wiring, coil, cdi, plug/cap. 

Not sure on hondas but kawasaki used to fit a resistor in the ignition switch, so any attempt to hot wire it would send too much voltage to the cdi and it'd not spark... Are you on the standard ignition barrel? 

This is why I keep asking him to check the voltage at the pink wire.

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4 hours ago, wavey said:

Is the pick up connected and does it have a healthy resistance? 

There's not a massive list of bits to stop it firing, pick up, wiring, coil, cdi, plug/cap. 

Not sure on hondas but kawasaki used to fit a resistor in the ignition switch, so any attempt to hot wire it would send too much voltage to the cdi and it'd not spark... Are you on the standard ignition barrel? 

The fact my 4/9, though its the 893 motor, when it was roadworthy, ran the original triarm ignition key/barrel makes me think there isn't any trickery in there tbh unless big h bothered a few years, before doing the hissy shit.. 

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Or if course they could have fitted the ignition with a similar resistor on the 400... 

Are you using the ignition barrel? 

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Ignition is aftermarket and had daft wiring colours but is all good with diode. I've a hideous feeling it was as simple as a poor earth from ignition coils but I can't check till tonight. That annoying thought will haunt me all day! 😂😂😂

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17 minutes ago, hawkati said:

Ignition is aftermarket and had daft wiring colours but is all good with diode. I've a hideous feeling it was as simple as a poor earth from ignition coils but I can't check till tonight. That annoying thought will haunt me all day! 😂😂😂

Only saw this thread yesterday...I probably should have been posting in here instead of  https://pbmagforum.co.uk/topic/74920-because-fukkit/page/6/#comments !

Those coils do have to be grounded else they won't fire:

One connection is a permanent 12v live via run stop switch.
The other is the trigger directly from CDI.
The metal body of the coil needs to be connected to ground / negative.

 

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2 hours ago, wavey said:

Or if course they could have fitted the ignition with a similar resistor on the 400... 

Are you using the ignition barrel? 

I can't say in all the years of owning 400 cbr's I have ever read or heard about the barrel being like that, but if they are, I have learnt something new . My 4/9, like james', is from 88/89, so was anyone even doing it that far back? 

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2 hours ago, hawkati said:

Ignition is aftermarket and had daft wiring colours but is all good with diode. I've a hideous feeling it was as simple as a poor earth from ignition coils but I can't check till tonight. That annoying thought will haunt me all day! 😂😂😂

Scullion.

what exactly is aftermarket?

when you say ignition do you mean the key switch, or the cdi? I am getting confused here.

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4 hours ago, Thunderbolt said:

Scullion.

what exactly is aftermarket?

when you say ignition do you mean the key switch, or the cdi? I am getting confused here.

I meant the key - ordered a new suitable blade one online (doh!) and got one with different coloured wires.

Fret ye notte....this bastard will fire up tonight! 

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5 hours ago, firebeast said:

I can't say in all the years of owning 400 cbr's I have ever read or heard about the barrel being like that, but if they are, I have learnt something new . My 4/9, like james', is from 88/89, so was anyone even doing it that far back? 

The engine,loom, coils & cdi are from a 97 blade and the concern expressed has been that the ignition barrel should have a diode to drop voltage. That's all good so with new cdi fitted and coils grounded it should fire tonight. I'd do it now but mum crisis in the morning meant very late start for viffer (backup)  collection. 

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44 minutes ago, hawkati said:

The engine,loom, coils & cdi are from a 97 blade and the concern expressed has been that the ignition barrel should have a diode to drop voltage. That's all good so with new cdi fitted and coils grounded it should fire tonight. I'd do it now but mum crisis in the morning meant very late start for viffer (backup)  collection. 

The blade loom and CDI do not need any voltage drop etc. Just good old 12v straight from the battery...sorted!

Edit - for 96/97 cdi and loom

Edited by dannn
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26 minutes ago, hawkati said:

The engine,loom, coils & cdi are from a 97 blade and the concern expressed has been that the ignition barrel should have a diode to drop voltage. That's all good so with new cdi fitted and coils grounded it should fire tonight. I'd do it now but mum crisis in the morning meant very late start for viffer (backup)  collection. 

I understand it all mate, I own 2 9r and know the issue well from them but haven't ever noticed it with older hondas from my own experience, but that's not too say its not there though, but I am surprised i haven't come across it in over 25 yrs with plenty of older hondas in that time.. 👍

It does sound more like its the other stuff from the threads you have so let's hope she fires up quickly 😉

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1 minute ago, dannn said:

The blade loom and CDI do not need any voltage drop etc. Just good old 12v straight from the battery...sorted!

Big h keeping it simple back then 👍

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8 minutes ago, firebeast said:

Big h keeping it simple back then 👍

Should be...well the 919 96/97 loom and CDI I have here only use 12 wires which corresponds to the two wiring diagrams I have.

Thinking about it I guess the later 919 98/99 may do something fancy with the ignition barrel with the cunty pink wire.

@hawkati how many wires have you got to the cdi on your loom...does it have that extra pink fucker I can see in the wiring diagram posted above which is different to one's I sent you ?

 

Edited by dannn
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